Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 22, 2008 22:12:02 GMT -5
Core Units20 Pikemen with Heavy Armor (220 points) 20 Pikemen with Heavy Armor (220 points) 20 Pikemen with Heavy Armor (220 points) 20 Crossbowmen (160 points) 20 Duelists with Bucklers (120 points) 20 Duelists with Bucklers (120 points) 10 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings (210 points) 20 Light Cavalry with Bows (300 points) Total points: 1570 points So, that leaves me 430 points to kit out my Lord and Characters and max out my magic defence  C&C is welcome  Oh, I'll be using whatever models I can find in my Gaming Club. Usually, they have some very old models. For Pikemen, I'll use High Elf Spearmen but I'll be cutting the helmet down. For Crossbowmen, I'll use Wood Elf Glade Guard. For Duelists, I'll use Dark Elf Warriors and I'll shave down the shield so they don't have the skull and wings. For Heavy Cavalry, I'll use Silver Helms and also cutting down the helmets. For Light Cavalry, I'll use Wood Elf Glade Riders.
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Post by Arguleon Veq on Jul 23, 2008 6:33:07 GMT -5
Ok, heres how I'd modify that list as It wont really work as it is now;
25 Pikemen with Heavy Armor (305 points); FC
25 Pikemen with Heavy Armor (305 points);FC
10 Crossbowmen (80 points)
10 Crossbowmen (80 points)
8 Duelists with Bucklers (48 points) X5
6 Light Cavalry with Bows; Musician X2
6 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings; FC X2
I originally though the elf models wouldnt work but after thinking about it, they probably will, withthe whole masks and hoods etc for the wood elves.
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 23, 2008 7:01:38 GMT -5
We can have musicians?!  *Checks DoW PDF* Oh...... Ok....so what's FC and the 'X 2' for? Ya, the Elf models looks nicer and more fashionable than Empire or Bretonnians I just have to cut down the helmets on those High Elves They remind me of Cone heads |
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Post by Arguleon Veq on Jul 23, 2008 7:06:04 GMT -5
FC = Full Command; Standard, Champion + Musician. The X[?] is the number of units, I didnt want to copy and paste loads of the same thing So 2 units of Light Cav, 2 of Heavy Cav, 5 units of Duellists. |
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 23, 2008 7:14:26 GMT -5
Ooooohhhh....... OK, how about: 24 Pikemen with Heavy Armor; FC 24 Pikemen with Heavy Armor;FC 8 Crossbowmen (80 points) 8 Crossbowmen (80 points) 8 Duelists with Bucklers (48 points) X4 8 Light Cavalry with Bows; Musician X2 8 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings; FC X2 This is so I can save a bit of cash and use everything How does this list fairs? |
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Post by Arguleon Veq on Jul 23, 2008 7:30:55 GMT -5
Crossbow minimum size is 10+.
Make the Heavy Cav 10 and 6. Theres very little point in 8, no more will attack and you dont get a rank bonus.
What characters are you taking?
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 23, 2008 7:52:21 GMT -5
24 Pikemen with Heavy Armor; FC 24 Pikemen with Heavy Armor; FC 12 Crossbowmen 12 Crossbowmen 8 Duelists with Bucklers (48 points) X4 8 Light Cavalry with Bows; Musician X2 10 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings; FC 6 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings; FC OK, this should do Right, I'll be using a Mercenary General, Paymaster, a Mercenary Captain and 2 Wizards (one of them Level 2) |
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Post by Red dog on Jul 23, 2008 11:35:43 GMT -5
By the looks of it, it sounds like a typical TVI. Meaning that -> - Its better of being Empire - You NEED stubborn units (Paymaster with bodygaurd) -----------------------------------------------------------> Further more - > - Knights should be re-done in this -> 5 or 6 vanila knights (not even musician, its TOO over priced for DoW). They will counter charge the units that will charge pikemen. Plus they won't give standards so they can flee when needed. They will fight in same unit that the infantry will so they don't need standards. - You need something that will make the opponent come to YOU. That means that you need Cannons. Don't argue, just take them. Take two by default. You got no good rares anyway. Plus with so much large creatures these days, cannon is a must for anyone who can have one. These 190 points will save your life many many times. ^_^ - Drop 2 duelist units, and may be one or both crossbowmen. - Heroes. Wizard with scrolls + Paymaster mounted with about 18 men body guard (with heavy armor, Full command and Warbanner). The rest... General for sure and maybe captain on the Pegasus to hunt warmachines and other week flyers. All heroes must be mounted and give HA+shield (except for wizard who can even chill with a cannon if he wants too). Brace of pistols is also a great choice(to stand & shoot). Followed by morning star(for paymaster and general who won't be charging) or great weapon. General should take ench shield and sword of might for maximum protection. I've made all the calculations and you still have points to spare. you can take 2 units of 5 vanilla fast cav. Or Ogres with GWs to break knights. Also hero-less Pikemen (Paymaster has body guard, General will lead the second unit) can be swapped on marauders since you have skirmishers to restrain there frenzy. Plus they are Frenzied meaning they are ItP. So thats that mate ^_^. I'd still just go with empire's Idiot as DoW are slightly underpowered  P.S. If you want a "desert army" why not take Tomb Kings? Or Dark Elves ("raider" kind of way)? Or hell, empire will do fine too, especially with TVI style. Also if this is "desert army" may be you want "all cav" kinda thing? Walk Tall everyone!!!!!  |
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Post by Arguleon Veq on Jul 24, 2008 7:50:35 GMT -5
It doesn't seem as though Cannons or the like suits his theme though.
TVI is ok for use with Pikes as the Pikes perform best when they are first charged, which increases the chances of holding. By giving the Heavy Cav command though, you have units that can go and take out smaller enemy units, can still beat some of the tougher missile units even when they have lost a few models. That can beat units with a Flank charge on their own. There is Fast Cav already in there for baiting etc.
Plus Zenny is trying to use certain boxed sets to limit the amount he has to buy, hence a lot of the numbers in his force.
As for the Paymaster, I like to stick him on a Barded Warhourse with Heavy Armour, Shield and Crossbow. For 85 points he gives you durability and a decent Crossbow shot to deal with lone characters and things like Skaven Weapon Teams.
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 24, 2008 8:53:21 GMT -5
Ya, Veqs got it but I think I'll take some of those cannons and stubborn troops. I'll come back with another list Thanks much |
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Post by Red dog on Jul 24, 2008 8:56:16 GMT -5
Well... TVI isn't really ok with pikes as they cost a bloody ton haha ^_^ But but! Pikes are very good unit non the less! I like their spirit (if only they strike before the d**n elves ) However they NEED general LD and Paymaster in same line. Over all, I find the pikes are 100% in the true spirit of TVI. I would love to see an effective TVI made out of DoW to show that good tactics still beat the crap out of broken books any day. ^_^ He can anchor his flank with a stubborn body gaurd (though how can you make them immune to fear...? that can pose an inconvinience tosay the least...) and second flank with terrain ***And I mean come on! They look like Macedonian (who had huge pikes lying on their shoulders) formation! How cool is that? ^_^ *** On cannons. Well cannons WERE used in Middle East a lot by Turkish Empire. So I mean fluff wise, it looks ok IMO. And those aren't even great cannons, so we can say they are "under developed"? ***Plus you can convert them or something. Or get stand ins or what/not*** On paymaster -> Well yeah, obviously mounted, barded, HA Then I'd give him morning star and Ench shield. I think he is more important then general and you DO not want him to die. That’s a +1 save and S5 on first turn. That’s 85 points. If you have spare points, a cross bow is neat idea. I mean he got a BS of 4, might as well use it ^_^ Though shoot or move... and the formation will move to get better positions and to simply intimidate. On Knights -> for 45 points, from both of those units (that’s 90 points!) I can almost get another unit of 5 knights... for 95 points I CAN get that unit ^_^ They do not need to charge the small unit because then they will brake the line and the whole line falls apart. Small units can’t do anything to a good TVI line. The unit of heavy cav that costs 95 points is probably THE best support heavy cav in the GAME. Better then empire knights in point/per stuff! They do the same job, but far more expendable and almost just as durable and hit JUST as hard. If anything, they are a great reason to build a DoW TVI because they are a priceless support unit. If ONLY I had that kind of support for my lizard idiot ^_^ On numbers... well I didn't knew that, but I mean heavy cav can be done out of empire knights or knights of realm, they are great plastic kits and cost a reasonable amount of money for a heavy cav unit. And the 16 knights he seems to be getting can be split in 3x5 the last one can be proudly converted into a paymaster or a general. Plus most of my suggestions involved reduction in numbers (23 instead of 24 and etc.)... P.S. Plus I'd save my cash on heroes and converted them out of regular models. How do you think I got my 2.25k on the El'Chippo budget? ^_^ Don't forget the center pieces! I know the pikes aren't to keen on that... But body guard can have like a 3x2(6 saved) or 2x2(4 saved) base that has a guy or two, carrying a HUGE chest with cash! I mean here is an awesome conversion and saving load of bloody money! ^_^ Plus fits the style perfectly! ^_^ I hope I helped ^_^ Walk Tall everyone!!!!! |
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Post by Arguleon Veq on Jul 24, 2008 10:43:50 GMT -5
On the point of getting a Fearless unit that is Stubborn, there are always Ogre Maneaters which only take a Special Choice on DoW. I take one as my Paymasters Bodygaurd. You could even have a few and join the Paymaster to them.
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Jul 27, 2008 10:43:42 GMT -5
Core Units
2 x 24 Pikemen with Heavy Armor and FC (588 points)
2 x 8 Duelists with Buckler (96 points)
2 x 8 Heavy Cavalry with Bardings and FC (426 points)
2 x 8 Light Cavalry with Bows (240 points)
Rare Units
2 x Cannons (170 points)
Total points: 1520 points (Another 480 points for a General, a Paymaster, a Captain and 2 Wizards)
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Post by Red dog on Jul 29, 2008 8:57:57 GMT -5
Zenny -> - You have 4 hero choices, not 5. So drop one wizard and give the one you have left, lvl1 and scrolls - Fast cav doesn't really need bows. Wastes points. Same with extra guys. Take 3x5 and you'll have a lot of versatility and split targets. - Heavy Cav... It does NOT work in units of 8... it just doesn't. 2x4 does not give you a rank bonus anymore. You need 2x5 if you want that rank. So as I said, just take 3 units of 5 Vanilla (command options are Horribly over priced). And there is no need to take "extra guys" so they die. Its not foot blocks (And not all footblocks do that, only cheap once). - Take that stubborn body guard, or maneaters as Veq suggested. (I have no experience with them though, so you have to ask how to use them good) Walk Tall everyone!!!!! |
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Zenai
Soldier
Zenai the Reluctant; Elector Count of GC
Posts: 63
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Post by Zenai on Aug 1, 2008 5:45:20 GMT -5
Oops, forgot about the rank thing Ok, so I'll drop one Wizard. And split them Light and Heavy Cavalry into into 3 group of 5. Hmmm.......I don't think Ogres are fluffy for my seafaring sultanate. I'll go for Bodyguards Right, I'll get another list done. Thanks loads. - Zenny |
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C&C is welcome 
Oh, I'll be using whatever models I can find in my Gaming Club. Usually, they have some very old models.
*Checks DoW PDF* Oh......
